During the audit, do we have to interview top management?

[Paul Simpson]

As I said previously - you audit the people that actually do the work

There's a statistic that hangs around those implementing lean managment that says that even those that "do" are only adding value less than 30% of the time and the rest of us are adding no value at all - makes you glad you turn up every morning.

Notice I said "turn up" not "work."

 

[Valeri]

Hey - half the battle is me getting here so I guess that means at this stage of life, I'm adding value somewhere between 0 & 15% (Don't be telling anyone that!)

 

[Paul Simpson]

Hey - half the battle is me getting here so I guess that means at this stage of life, I'm adding value somewhere between 0 & 15% (Don't be telling anyone that!)

It's even worse, Valeri. I didn't explain too well. Unless you are in production / Service and you make something or provide something as a service that is directly chargeable to the customer you are down as "non value adding."

That includes all the "value adding stuff" that we think we do in support functions - quality planning, auditing, training, anything else you care to mentioned counts for a big fat zero if you think Lean.

 

[Valeri]

It's even worse, Valeri. I didn't explain too well.

OK, OK stop explaining already.:mg:

 

[JaneB]

If this is the right approach then why isn't everyone doing it?

Ah hah. That's the 'magic'question. And If I knew the answer, I'd be a very rich woman, and perhaps also know what happens to all those single socks....

 

[Crusader]

During the audit, do we have to interview top management?

Of course! Our Top Management(TM) has plenty of responsibilities and just like everyone else, TM is audited.

 

[Bill Pflanz]

For a job that adds no value, it is amazing how many job postings there are for quality professionals.

Bill Pflanz

 

[Helmut Jilling]

It's even worse, Valeri. I didn't explain too well. Unless you are in production / Service and you make something or provide something as a service that is directly chargeable to the customer you are down as "non value adding."

That includes all the "value adding stuff" that we think we do in support functions - quality planning, auditing, training, anything else you care to mentioned counts for a big fat zero if you think Lean.

I thnk it would be more appropriate to refer to it as Indirect labor, not non-value-added. Most accountants I speak with call it Indirect. Maybe some anti-ISO managers call it non-value, but by they're defintion, top managent is non-value also...

 

[Helmut Jilling]

How does the CB audit the effectiveness of to management commitment (Clause 5) if they don't speak to top management? I'm just in the middle of a reassessment audit and had separate interviews set up for the morning of day 1 with the two joint Managing Directors to talk about their role in setting policy (5.3), objectives, targets (5.4.1) and internal communications (5.5.3).

On Friday (day 5) I have a joint session with both of them to test out some of the statements from the start of the audit and to assess the process measures actually filter their way back to them (8.2.3).

If this is not the right approach I would be happy to be shown the right one.

If this is the right aproach then why isn't everyone doing it?

It is the right approach, but some companies don't get it. There are some top executives that are so full of their own importance, they have no time for this silly stuff...no wonder so many big automotive suppliers are stuggling... is there a correlation there???

 

[Helmut Jilling]

We have a large company with many VPs and do over $2billion in revenue a year. That said, interviewing the CEO by 3rd party auditors or internal auditor has not and will never happen. However, there many VPs and they regularly review quality system metrics, but we never interview them and neither does our registrar, its pretty much how we both like it.

That does in fact violate the requirements, but sadly it is not uncommon.